Lorain/Elyria, OH
Elyria to try tax in May
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ELYRIA — A divided City Council voted to place a tax issue on the ballot that will ask residents to pass a permanent income tax increase and permanent income tax credit reduction in an all-or-nothing campaign.
After three hours of heated conversation touching upon closing the city’s ice rink, possibly laying off city employees and putting a double income tax proposal on the May ballot, Council passed the measure in a 7-to-4 vote.
In favor of the measure were Forrest Bullocks, D-2nd Ward, Donna Mitchell, D-6th Ward, Ken Burkhard, D-7th Ward, Kevin Brubaker, D-at large, Tom Callahan, D-at large, Mike Lotko, D-at large, and Vic Stewart, D-at large.
Believing now is not the time to ask voters for more money, council members Larry Tanner, D-1st Ward, Garry Gibbs, R-3rd Ward, Mark Craig, I-4th Ward, and Kevin Krischer, I-5th Ward.
“It’s a joke,” Krischer said following the meeting. “We just caused more division in the city than ever.”
However, Grace said he believes a strong campaign aimed to educate voters on where the additional revenue will be spent will get the issue passed.
“As challenging as times are, I’m very optimistic the community will recognize how important it is, not just for the immediate needs of the city, but also the long-term financial health of the city,” he said. “It will be up to city leaders and elected officials to convey that message to residents to get this issue passed.”
Still, Grace told a packed audience, many of them the parents of young hockey players who will have nowhere to play if the city closes the ice rink, that putting the tax proposal on the May ballot will not stop cuts that must be made to balance the 2009 budget amid a projected $3 million shortfall.
And city finances can’t wait until May, Grace said.
However, should the tax proposal pass, officials would move to call back laid-off employees and reinstate cut programs and services.
Without the tax passing, there is no telling when the programs will come back, Grace said.
Many came out to Monday’s meeting to speak out about how the cuts to the city’s Parks and Recreation Department would affect their quality of life.
“Why in the devil would we close our ice skating rink when every Friday you can go there and find 300 kids in there who paid money to be there?” said John Vanco, a resident and former member of the Parks and Recreation Board.
Just knowing there was a possibility that the rink could close was enough to make 10-year-old Cameron Anderson come to Monday’s meeting. Seated with his parents, Cameron said he has been playing at North Rec’s rink since he was 6.
“I’m a little worried that they are going to close it,” he said. When asked what his life would be like without hockey, Cameron only had one word, “boring.”
There are no other ice skating or hockey rinks in Lorain County, which is why the Elyria rink draws from all over the area, said Mike Fritz of Oberlin.
“The Elyria Ice Hockey Club self-organizes, but we need the rink to be there,” he said. “When I heard about this, I could only think about how the quality of my life is going down.”
Parks and Recreation Director Frank Gustoff said he doesn’t know what will happen with the ice rink past next Friday, but he is optimistic that something can be worked out to keep it open for the rest of the season.
In the meantime, Law Director Terry “Pete” Shilling is working on crafting the ballot language for the tax proposal as well as corresponding legislation that will spell out where the additional money will go.
Based on Monday’s discussion, reducing the income tax credit to 75 percent could net the city an additional $1.15 million each year, which will be allocated to the Police Department.
To be seen on the same ballot is a second proposal that will replace the 0.5 percent temporary income tax with a 0.75 percent permanent income tax, bringing Elyria’s total income tax to 2 percent. Increasing the income tax could generate an additional $3 million a year. About $1.3 million would be directed to the Street Department for paving and construction, facilities, equipment and personnel. The Parks and Recreation Department would receive roughly $950,000.
The Fire Department would receive about $650,000 — about $50,000 more than what city officials plan to cut from the department’s budget. However, that number was much lower until Callahan recommended $500,000 set aside for downtown improvement be lowered to $100,000.
Concerning city employee layoffs, Grace said nothing has been decided, but all cuts will take place the week of Feb. 23. In the meantime, Grace will meet with the Fire Department’s union leaders today to discuss whether they would be receptive to pay concessions to help the budget. In addition, Grace said the employees who work for the elected officials are being asked to consider reducing their hours, which would cut their pay by roughly 10 percent.
Contact Lisa Roberson at 329-7121 or lroberson@chroniclet.com.
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I am so sick and tired of the deception and tactics this administration uses. I can guarantee I will never vote for aditional taxes in Elyria. I do believe that taxes can be justified but what good does it do to vote in more taxes only to be mismanaged by the people who collect it. It’s high time for a change.
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Mayor Grace showed his true colors and HATE for the fire dept. Made himself look like a bigger fool than we all know he is. Tax has no chance. I’m sick of 7 to 4 every vote. Bullocks.Burkhart,Mitchell,Stewart,Callahan,Brubaker and Lotko MUST GO!!! The mayors pawns. NEVER REPRESENT US VOTERS!!! They make me sick!!!!!
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QUOTE - However, Grace said he believes a strong campaign aimed to educate voters on where the additional revenue will be spent will get the issue passed.
Issue 15 to keep your safety forces was meant to educate the voters. You did educate the voters: NOT TRUSTING YOU ANYMORE.
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I’m already educated. NO!
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im tired of the lies down with grace
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they have to be NUTS if they think they are going to get a tax increase from elyria voters, They are already raising
the sales tax after we said no. thiese people need to
be inpeach!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, the federal goverment is trying to help us These idiots in elyria (Grace) All they can do is
raise our taxes. People have spoken GRACE no new
taxes . Stop wasting tax payers money by putting this on the ballot
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So, just to be clear, Grace and his hand-picked crack team on Planning Commission are actively harassing new and existing businesses and chasing away potential businesses through their hostile attitude and lame brained sign and building material requirements and now they want more money?
What I absolutely love about this plan is that after driving away businesses, wasting money on a economic development director who’s shown NO results and years of frivolus spending, they want to punish folks who work outside of Elyria by double taxing them?!?!
Pay close attention folks, because Grace, Lotko and Brubaker (to name a few) WON’T have to contribute as much as the rest of us because they work in town. Must be nice to hit others with a tax that you DON’T have to pay and then can waste on more pet projects. I don’t believe for a minute that the money will be spent the way that they say it will. Or, rather, this money will be spent the way they say, but then they will reduce the General Fund contributions to things like Police, Fire, Parks and Streets so that they can continue to waste our money.
Enough is enough. Where are the $500k in cuts that you said you could make Mayor Grace? Why won’t you lead by example? When are you going to learn to live within your means just like the rest of us have been doing for years?
I encourage everyone to vote NO on this ridiculous attempt to change our temporary tax to permanent and place a double tax on folks who are lucky enough to even have a job, but have to work outside of town because business here is dead.
I for one will vote NO, and I’ll use the voting roster from last night’s meeting as my election guide - if you said “Yes” I’ll say “No” to you in November.
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Hey Mayor Grace. I’m sure I speak for the majority when I say this. WE WON’T VOTE ON ANY NEW TAXES. We have nothing left to give. Our water bills are going up, our electric is going up, our pocketbooks are getting smaller by the minute, and you want the citizens of Elyria to vote on MORE money to be taken out of our wallets???? NO WAY!!!! I hope and pray that this issue is voted down. We don’t need EDUCATED we need RESULTS. Show us some of that and maybe you might get some support. I doubt it though.
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Mayor Grace has single handedly taken this entire city down. In my opinion, after Issue 15, he deserves no support. It is time for the citizens to take control and clean up the trash in City Hall.
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I am sure, like everyone right now, the city does need more money now and even in the future. I work outside of the city, and I would be more than happy to lower my credit, IF King Grace would for once tell the whole truth and stop with the threats. The city is like my home, times get tough I either cut my cost or I find a way to bring in more income. So I understand the situation, and I have no problem paying my fair share, but the deception this administration runs the city with, I cannot tolorate. The only way I will vote for either one of these is if Grace resigns, not a promise he won’t run for re-election for I am sure he would change his mind later, but out and out resigns. He has hurt this city more than help it, the city is tearing itself apart as a direct result of him and his policies.
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The headline is misleading. It should say “taxes” because they’re trying to hit people two ways. The first by increasing the tax rate and the second by reducing the credit people working outside the city. Just like our great County Commissioners…GREEDY BA$TARD$!
If this is the only ice rink in the county then it seems it can be run like a business. Staff it with full-time employees and charge an appropriate rate to cover your costs.
Our city leaders need to start living within their means, not in a dreamland.
Laying off PT employees before any FT employees is a flawed way of operating any organization or business. Whether it’s a union contract issue or city ordinance issue, it needs to be changed. Imagine how many businesses would be closed down if they operated like this?
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Janettor, were you in the same meeting as I was last night??? Because if you were you would have noticed a couple things I did. I am a hockey mom and I will tell you there were more people there to support parks then the shadiness that goes on in the fire dept!!! I want the recs/and ice rink open. those people get 9 MILLION dollars to operate a fire dept. I am tires of the rec dept always being taken out because fire wants wants wants. Its got to STOP!
As for the tax, I will support it 100% and I will rally all the people involved in the rec. program if I have too.
Also if my notes serve me correct Janettor, the vote to put it on the ballot was 7-4. How the money should be spent was 10-1!!! did you and this paper fail to tell the citizens that!!!!
I dont know much about the politics of this city and Janettor from the sounds of it neither do you. But since you called out the 7, I will call out the 4 who voted against it because when you say the 7 didnt represent the citizens or whatever your babble was, the 4 didnt represent me or my family and I am a CITIZEN too. So Craig, Krischer, Gibbs and Tanner MUST GO!!!!
By the way do Tanner and Krischer chew gum during these meetings? Neither one was coherent.
Good day to all.
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Just found this on another site, looks like we will be debating this until november because the Elyria charter does not allow for these measures to go on the ballot unless there is at least 90 days between council passage and the election. Thanks for the ingo Loraincountyspeaks
SECTION 20.04 VOTER APPROVAL OF INCOME TAX.
Any ordinance or resolution listed below in paragraphs (a) or (b)
will
not become effective, after passage thereof, until Council submits such
ordinance or resolution to the electorate at a regular municipal or
general
election occurring more than ninety (90) days after the passage of the
ordinance or resolution, and such ordinance or resolution is approved by
a
majority of the electors voting thereon in the city:
(a) One approving or providing for any increase, or the renewal
or
the extension of any increase in the municipal income tax rate charged
upon
any and all income taxable within the City of Elyria; or
(b) One approving or providing for any decrease, or the renewal
or
extension of any decrease in the municipal income tax credit allowable
for
any and all income taxable within the City of Elyria.
(Enacted 5-8-07)
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I am employed in Elyria but am fortunate enough that Amherst allows me to pay income taxes as well. How these cities can double dip is just absolutely mind blowing.
The fact that I don’t get to vote on this proposal really burns me. I’m effected just like everyone else. What ever happened to no taxation without representation???
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I for one will never vote for this. I know my family members won’t either. The mayor needs to find a way to deal with his “Faults” himself and not lay it on us. As many have said, or purse strings are tightened enough. Now he wants more money to put into his “Prawns” pockets. I don’t think so. I’m educated from EHS, and so I know the difference between being a sucker and stupid, and since I am neither, I will not support it, so don’t even send me that junk in my mail or put anything in my lawn, cause I will put it right back on yours!
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I’m not against the tax issue going to ballot - remember that this is OUR vote - our chance to say NO to the mayor.
The problem I have is that there will likely be money spent to ‘educate’ the taxpayers that we can’t afford to be spending right now because i believe it will overwhelmingly fail - thus wasting our money.
As far as the hockey rink and league plays and such - if it’s so important to the parents and kids - let the parents volunteer to run it, maintain it, and organize it.
the parks are a non-essential.
if someone’s kid dies because the police or fire couldn’t respond fast enough to an emergency - then having the hockey rink open wouldn’t matter anyway because the kid wouldn’t be using it from 6 feet under. (crude, blunt - yes - but straight to the point of separating essentials from non)
950k to the parks and only 250k to the fire department? that is a clear statement of the mayor’s priorities and our safety isn’t it!
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Rayvon, please read the article, the fire dept is getting some 650k, not 250k. Thats a lot of money for people, oh never mind, its a lot of money for them. The Rec. dept. DESERVES their fair share also. The city is in the service business and recs is a service. I DEMAND that service and DEMAND the right to vote for that money to keep the service. PERIOD. Regardless of what 1 angry exfireman says, recs are important. I am tired of giving everything to the fire dept. police cruisers falling apart yet the fire dept ahs millions of new vehicles! Shame on them. Why cant we have a volunteer dept.
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Ms. Hockeymom, I don’t know you but I will say that you have fallen exactly hook line and sinker for what Mayor Grace wants to accomplish, that is to divide and conquer!
The Mayor wants to pit union against union, Department against Department and have you, the citizen pick a side as if this is some game show or reality T.V. program.
For you,your family and fellow Elyria citizens ,protection is a priority and while I totally sympathize with you and your feelings towards the Parks and Rec Programs, when times are tough cities need to prioritize what it can give its citizens and police fire and health services must come first.
Do I want the Parks to close down? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!
What I am most upset with is how the Administration last night showed its true feelings, and attempted to play to the crowd by misinformation.
If you want to know exactly how much fire protection costs and why and how much personnel are needed call the fire chiefs office or stop by a fire station. The same for the Police or Parks for that matter.
It is the people that do the job day in and day out and have committed their life to such voacations who know exactly what it takes, and you will find that there is no “shadiness” in the EFD, only dedicated hard working men and women who will give it their all for you and your family when you call.
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Ms. Hockeymom, I don’t know you but I will say that you have fallen exactly hook line and sinker for what Mayor Grace wants to accomplish, that is to divide and conquer!
The Mayor wants to pit union against union, Department against Department and have you, the citizen pick a side as if this is some game show or reality T.V. program.
For you,your family and fellow Elyria citizens ,protection is a priority and while I totally sympathize with you and your feelings towards the Parks and Rec Programs, when times are tough cities need to prioritize what it can give its citizens and police fire and health services must come first.
Do I want the Parks to close down? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!
What I am most upset with is how the Administration last night showed its true feelings, and attempted to play to the crowd by misinformation.
If you want to know exactly how much fire protection costs and why and how much personnel are needed call the fire chiefs office or stop by a fire station. The same for the Police or Parks for that matter.
It is the people that do the job day in and day out and have committed their life to such voacations who know exactly what it takes, and you will find that there is no “shadiness” in the EFD, only dedicated hard working men and women who will give it their all for you and your family when you call.
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Let those who use the pools and ice rink pay for it , PAY AS YOU PLAY . Those of us who dont use those facilities should not have to pay for them. no one kicks in any money for my pass times or entertainment , or baby sitting . pay for you own , leave us alone ……..
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Every family in Elyria has had to learn to DO MORE with LESS over the last few years. I think its high time the city does the same.
Do your job Mayor, think out side the box and come up with some cost saving measure’s.
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Let the Elyria Hockey Club run the rink. The city should lease them the Rec Center for $1 and let them run it. No city or union involvement.
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There is no way anyone is going to vote for more taxes. This will never pass.
I hate when people write articles and leave out facts. This article is about an income tax increase and a lesser tax credit for residents that live outside of Elyria. Why would the person that wrote this article leave out the details of the lesser tax credit? How bad is the tax credit going to be?
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Mr. pronesti, I undertsand your position. BUT Iam a very intelligent woman and I can decide for myself if I believe what the Mayor says or not. I dont. And I dont believe what the fire dept says either.But I want the opportunity to decide IF I want to pay for Rec activities through a tax measure and for Mr. Krischer to call it a joke AFTER he voted for it just goes to show the ignornace of Mr. Kischer.
Iam picking a side based on what I want, rec.programs and police. Followed by fire and streets.
I again will support this thing and I know a lot of people who will also, and I also know people who wont. But they can vote how they want.
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Hockeymom; You go to one meeting and now you know everything. The million dollar truck the fire dept got last 20 years. Do you want them to carry buckets? I never said parks aren’t important. If my house catches fire or I have a burglary at my house I want protection. If this mayor didn’t hire and give raises to everyone he knows and attracted business to the area there would be more tax dollars and jobs. His design review and planning commission along with Brackendoff have chased business away. To give $900,000 to fix the downtown would be better spent on dynamite. That doesn’t even factor in the Block grant money. The over spending on Rt 57 by 13 million and growing,over budget on city hall and the court house and the waiving of building permit fees on the court house are even a better example of mismanagement. His private attorney(also head of dem party) a waste. $650.00 a month in money he doesn’t account for. Mileage paid on an estimate not real miles a waste. 4 asst. safety service directors and 4 secretaries in his office -overkill. Clerk of council has 1 full time and a pt secretary (for a pt time position. (overkill) Insurance for all council members even though it’s a pt job. Law directors has pt time people getting insurance benefits. We pay the county for economic development and also pay someone with no background in it for the same thing. We are getting custom street light that we have to maintain in stead of Ohio Edisons free light that they maintain. $100,000 dollars for black guard rails that you can’t see when pulling off the road at night.Paying Elyria school crossing guards out of city funds, what about the people in Elyria that live in the Midview school district having to fund that out of tax dollars. How about the mayor mowing Moens lawn,weed whacking it and repair the parking lot and striping it for the band to practice. Why do Midview people pay taxes for a school that has their own levy and employees? So before you hammer someone that you THINK doesn’t know whats going on,do a little research and find out the truth. You seem to be in the minority that believes all the mayor says! Janet
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Hockeymom- One of your own people said 60% of the hockey players don’t even live in this city. I also take offense to call the firefighters, police officers or city workers liars. Your anger only blurs your judgment.
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Janetor, YOUR anger blurs your judgement. Those 60% bring in more money then a lot of people in this city. Stores, eateries, dry cleaning, and fees to parks. How much revenue does the fire dept raise vs its expenditures? I know the parks bring in money. How much secondary money does the fire dept bring in?
Your right, IF there is a fire I want the fire dept. IF!!! I have a higher chance of dying then I do of having a fire in my house. Medical emergencies, Lifecare has been to my house for my elderly father in law and I will tell you the 2 times Lifecare came, both times they were there before the truck from Bell ave came. and 1 time they didnt even stop, they slowed saw Lifecare there and kept going!!
No Janettor, I want the parks programs, police then streets and fire.
Why after 40 years are you CRYING about the money spent on crossing guards?
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Grace needs to immediately cut the $500,000 from city hall that he said he could. He then needs to resign immediately. Then, and only then, I might consider a temporary tax to bail us out of the current situation. If this does not happen, or the tax will be permanent, I vote NO!
While I sympathize with people who use and work in Parks & Rec, I want strong safety services first.
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JanetTor for Mayor!!! Makes more sense than Mayor DIs Grace. We who live in the real world and work hard, then save our money to afford something and try and live with in our means. I for one and sick of everything going up with no raise or cost of living pay increase but that I am employee bye a company that wants to be around in the years to come. No way in _ell this tax goes threw just like in the fall we can vote down Kowkoski”s sales tax.
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UNBELIEVABLE!!!! What more can you say? Why is it when you read the chronicle or Urinal, that ALL the talk is about Grace and Elyria? You DON’t see this happening to Any other city in the COUNTY!!! or other counties for that matter!! Something is WAAAY WAAAY wrong here! It is COMPLETELY OUT OF CONTROL!!! Asking for even more $$$$ by the leaders who overspent Millions? C’MON!!! You pulled the most unbelievable trick last fall and now its time for an encore!!!
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Hockeymomma
I see you’re new to the Chronicle so welcome. Now please don’t say my anger blurs my judgment, Mayor Grace for some reason hates the Fire department and for some other reason needs a lot of money for the Parks and Rec’s system real bad, I am wondering if there is a big money problem that is about to explode in Mayor Grace’s face?
Go to youtube, type in the search bar, (Elyria mayor grace vs tax on ballot) watch the video because the more Grace spoke about the Fire Department at the end of the video from where I was standing it seemed his face got red from possibly his anger blurring his judgment.
Now it is a possibility that there might have to be a waiting period of 90 days before the tax issue can be put on the ballot, therefore no vote on tax issue so to speak until Nov. this year, so my question is, what is Mayor Grace going to do? Well by the video of the last meeting part # 2 it seems Mayor Grace has no clue of what to do.
Ken Behner aka dirtdigger
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Any individual who says their priorities are Parks and Rec B4 Safety Services proclaims their ignorance for all to see.
No need to debate this kind of ignorance. It is beyond logic,comprehension and understanding.
I am no longer surprised by the downward spiral Elyria is taking. With citizens like this,thinking like this, it is very evident why Elyria is circling the drain.
Maybe it isn’t even circling the drain anymore maybe it already has been flushed?
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Hockeymamma - You stated that you did not trust Disgrace.
Okay what makes you think that the rink is going to stay open if this tax is passed in May or Nov?
Is it how Disgrace led the people of Elyria to believe that this last levy was a safety issue and then promptly started laying off those safety forces?
You cannot believe anything that comes out of that mans mouth and you are going to vote for a tax increase thinking it is going to keep that rink open let alone thinking that your hockey program is more important than the city not having enough fire stations and firefighters to fight a fire.
I am a huge sports fan and have coached for years and hate that the programs for children are going away and all because Disgrace is incompetent but get your priorities right.
You should lead the way as the spokesperson for this tax increase and use your belief that a hockey program is more important than safety forces and the issue will be sure to go down the tubes. Not that I think it has a snowball chance in hell of passing.
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Hey Hobbies? Do you have homeowners insurance? Auto insurance? How much does it pay you? Police and fire depts are insurance policies! You and hockey mom think about that.
News flash!!!!! Taxes off ballot!!!!! Inept mayor misses deadline!!!! Blame that on the fire dept. You trust someone that has mismanaged our money and misses a deadline? Holly Brinda wrote an article that shows Elyria didn’t apply for federal funds,Lorain did and is getting more that $300,000+ and state funds. We get 400% increase in utilities and Lorain gets federal money. Did you take a body check into the boards and hit or head or oops I forgot you trust our mayor! You are a party of two!!!
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I hope that now that it is official those of us on both sides of the tax issue can come together as one and recognize that the city of ELyria lacks leadership. Unfortunately there will be stiff layoffs now that it has been determined that the tax proposal can not go on the may ballot and will have to be decided upon in my. I feel for those who’s jobs are in jepordy, however your anger should be expressed with the office of Mr Grace. He waited until the last possible minute to bring this forward, he himself said he new of the economy tanking in Oct. Why then did he wait until less than 90 days to try and move forward with a tax increase. I hope for the sake of Elyria we come together and make some changes in how our city is run. Mr Grace you have dropped the ball on the future of Elyria and the great employees, in alll departments and I hope this is the end to your political career.
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First I dont have faith in Mayor Grace running our city any longer,
But I also dont have faith in the leadership of the FD or PD.
I would like to see the breakdowns of salaries for last year for the PD / FD’s.
I’d imagine there is allot of waste going on in those departments that could easly be cut out.
In fact this week at the local water hole it was discussed that the top 8 earners at the FD made over 1.2m last year…
any truth in that?
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oh and I forgot to add, I support the idea of pay to use. I for one don’t have children that use the ice rink. Why should my tax dollars go to maintenance of a facility so people from other cities can use?
My kids play flag football, I dont see the c ity building a special stadium for them…
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Safety forces are more important than parks. That’s from someone who loves our parks and lessons. I think what we’re starting to forget here is we do not trust Grace to do the right thing with our safety forces. Why would we, he’s already lied to us.
Let’s also not forget that North Park MAKES money. The late comers to this forum has missed where most of us have stated that this was EXACTLY what Grace was going to do to get more money out of us.
Get rid of some dead weight and then we can talk. Until then, NO MORE MONEY!
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There are ulterior motives to everything this guy does. Don’t believe for one second that part of this fiasco is his burning desire to have a centralized pool. Every time he opens his mouth, another lie comes out.
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Instead of asking taxpayers for more money, let’s reduce some of the excessive benefits…
“Based on Monday’s discussion, reducing the income tax credit to 75 percent could net the city an additional $1.15 million each year, which will be allocated to the Police Department.”
> In 2008, $1,460,975 was paid out in Accumulated Sick time and $852,534 in Comp time. Cut these in half and you’ve got the $1.15 million we need for the EPD.
“To be seen on the same ballot is a second proposal that will replace the 0.5 percent temporary income tax with a 0.75 percent permanent income tax, bringing Elyria’s total income tax to 2 percent. Increasing the income tax could generate an additional $3 million a year.”
> In 2008, $3,069,721 was paid in Longevity. Eliminate this excessive perk and we have the money we need for the EFD, Parks & Rec, and the Street Dept.
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VOTE NO, I DID!
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I voted no on issue 23 as well as issue 7
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